Ramsey Russell, Backwoods Grind Coffee Podcast

Jonathan Wilson: Welcome to The Backwoods Grind podcast, I’m Jonathan Wilson, your host. I’ve got Zack Kile here, my co-host and we are extremely excited about this episode today.

Zack Kile: Yes sir, we really are. We got a surprise shout from Ramsey Russell and getducks.com today. He said he wanted to stop by the shop before he got out of town and so man, welcome to The Backwoods Grind podcast.

Ramsey Russell: Man, I’m glad to be here. I’ve only been here 20 minutes, I’ve already got a coffee buzz going. Good stuff, man.

Zack Kile: We really appreciate you stopping by. We know you’re a busy guy. Interestingly enough where I first heard of you was old Rocky Leflore’s podcast. And I remember calling Jonathan after listening to you all’s podcast and I said, look, there’s these guys and they keep talking about coffee and they’re going to be the perfect people to reach out to. And I actually sent coffee out to Rocky Leflore. And we talked a little bit. So, I don’t know if there’s anybody that, we will have on that’s enjoyed coffee in more places than you.

Ramsey Russell: Yeah.

Zack Kile: And man, what a cool person to have on.

“I spend my whole life around duck hunters and I can count on one hand the number of duck hunters I know that don’t drink coffee. And I’m always a little suspect, who is this guy?”

Ramsey Russell: I spend my whole life around duck hunters and I can count on one hand the number of duck hunters I know that don’t drink coffee. And I’m always a little suspect, who is this guy?

Zack Kile: Right. That is really cool. And not only that, but you have an excellent podcast. I’ve enjoyed your podcast many episodes and so to have you here, you’re a local guy to us and man, it’s just exciting to have you.

Ramsey Russell: Well, you all are neighbors and Rocky Leflore in The End of The Line podcast did send me down this trail and unfortunately he went on to bigger and better things and I said, well, I’ve still got story to tell and I’ve got people – I mean I travel so much and I just value the stories that I hear in the duck blind around duck camp. And it doesn’t matter if you’re 6800 miles from home or 30 minutes away from right there in your backyard. It’s this real common, this universal truth among duck hunters I find out. And I love that, the food and the culture. Do you all have any idea how much coffee I drink in a year?

Zack Kile: I can only imagine.

Ramsey Russell: I mean, by the end of these big tours and stuff we do, I’m running purely on fumes propelled by caffeine and nicotine.

“So, that’s a question I had. So, is the coffee, is it different when you leave the country, what is that like? Getting coffee? Getting access to it? Is it taste better, worse? What is it like when you leave the country?”

Zack Kile: So, that’s a question I had. So, is the coffee, is it different when you leave the country, what is that like? Getting coffee? Getting access to it? Is it taste better, worse? What is it like when you leave the country?

Ramsey Russell: Some people don’t have a coffee culture. In fact man, relative to us here in the United States, I’d have to really think hard for anybody that’s got a coffee culture anywhere near ours. And some of the places you go, thank goodness, it’s tolerable. Some of the places we go, Azerbaijan or Argentina’s got terrible coffee. If you go into a café, McDonald’s even they’ve got those little – I don’t know what you call those machines with all the dials, they really don’t have coffee. You get a coffee Americano which is espresso diluted down with water, it’s not coffee. But you get off of some of these countries, I’m thinking like Azerbaijan comes to mind it’s instant baby, it’s instant coffee and it ain’t like this cup of coffee right here but it does the trick.

Jonathan Wilson: Still got the caffeine.

Ramsey Russell: It’s not the old stuff we drink back in the 70s, it’s okay, but it’s got the kick. Hit it with enough cream and sweetener, it’s tolerable. But you get off into some countries that do have, I do like those fancy machine coffee, I like to expresso and stuff like that.

Jonathan Wilson: Yeah. Cool. So, we’re lucky to get you on. You just told us you’re heading out with the first week of August heading –

Ramsey Russell: Thank goodness man, 3^rd of August. You know, I did travel a lot throughout the United States last year, a whole bunch and through Mexico but it’s kind of been parked since March, April and that’s very strange because I’m used to being home for 2 weeks and traveling. I mean, its duck season somewhere, which means its duck season everywhere. And I didn’t realize until this summer just born and raised in Mississippi, I still just hadn’t grown overly finally about this heat and humidity. I kind of like being in a duck season, it keeps the weather cool and stuff. So, things are starting to open and I leave August 3^rd for Africa and we’ll get back home on about the 25^th, birds only. I’ve shot some game animals over there, but its geese and ducks and partridge and guinea fowl and doves and pigeons, it’s just a shotgun safari. The volume is good, but there’s some really cool species over there too. A lot of clients going, they want to have fun, but they want to collect some species and it’s just a huge adventure.

Zack Kile: That’s cool. So, how did getducks.com come to be? You are a globetrotting duck God, you put your name behind these people that you trust. How did all of this get started?

“He said there ain’t a lodge in that country that rivals my guest house, he said, but if you come to my duck camp and it’s a good duck camp, I got a 10 by 70 mobile home if you want a place to sit and eat your rib eye steak, you got to pull a lab off that couch. He said, son, I want to go on a real duck – I’m a real duck hunter, I want to go on a real duck hunting.”

Ramsey Russell: Zack, it really is by accident. I tell people all the time in retrospect, when you come to a fork in the road, take it, just keep moving forward. And I told the story earlier today that someone on the phone had asked but I’ve got a real good friend I call Mr. Ian, he was a professor of mine at Mississippi State. We’ve been duck hunting together for nearly 30 years. And when I got out of college I had enough money because I had a job to go to Canada. I always wanted to go to Canada to shoot migraters Canada’s. And we bought it from a “foremost outfitter” that was dealing with that too. And you just can’t make up how bad that hunt was. Supposed to be 8 people in camp, there were 30 people in camp. There were no snow geese, they told us that’s all we shot was snow geese. The first morning they said be ready at 05:30, 05:30 came and went 06:30, 07:30 at 08:30 inebriated Native American showed up, he was so drunk, he couldn’t stand without leaning on his truck and we went out and shot one bird or two. And we ended up salvaging, the year was 1998 we ended up salvaging it. One of the guys I was with from Michigan, jumped up and we had seen a bunch of geese, he had god dang took off like a green beret over the horizon and found those geese. And it was epic couple of days but it was terrible. The highlight mill was boiled – I’ll never forget that outfitter standing up on the table. Yeah, banging his pot breakfast, I hear everybody complaining about the food, he said, but tonight we’re eating steak and I’m thinking my mouth started watering. As we were walking up to the mess hall that evening, everybody’s talking about the steak, I said, I don’t smell smoke. It’s like going to a rib joint. If you walk into a rib joint, you don’t smell smoke, something’s up. And that’s another Canadian story. But we walked in and he had just taken chunks of beef or the cook had taken big chunks of beef, I guess that was a steak, whatever they call it and boiled it. And it was horrible. And so we got out and the internet was not what the internet is today, but we got out and did some research and I found a guy named Jeff Klotz Alberta Flyway Outfitters up in Alberta. And he later described the initial phone call that being an interrogation between the IRS and NSA and everybody else beat them with a rubber hose in bright light. And we showed up in Canada 4 of us did, had a wonderful time. The following year that was about 8 or 10 of us. The following year, 25 or 30 people booked to go up there with this guy really a good hunt, right part of the world and the right outfitter. And he called me out in the shout and said, I want you to be a booking agent. I’m a foster with the US Federal government, what is that? He said, I want you to sell my hunts. And so we came back and I’m like, well I need to build one of these newfangled web pages to reach people. And there were two products I did habitat consulting and I sold Alberta and I had a career with the US Federal government had no idea where what this was going to turn into. And what I see in this industry and I see it today in social media with people that do something similar to what we do, I told an outfitter today, he called me up, sells a hunt and I said sir, I don’t know you. Well, I’m the best and I’m this and I’m that I said, every outfitter I’ve ever talked to is best, if you don’t believe me ask them. But after 20 years I’ve built a reputation and name and I can’t send my client to somebody that I’ve never put boots on the ground and you may be the best and if you are I’ll be telling everybody about you but unless you are. And so that takes an investment on my part because now, I’ve got to go there and take a look at whoever I’m looking at. And if it means going to Romania which we don’t hunt or some of these other far flung countries that sounded good, look good, we go, like not the same American experience, but it’s okay. It’s like, when you go and look at a hunt, like if I’ve got a hunt on getducks.com that I truly believe in Rio Salado is where I want my ashes scattered. It’s not that it’s Argentina, it’s that it’s after 20 years of going to Argentina and visiting 60-70 outfitters, I’ve got a perspective of where it is in the world of Argentina. You know what I’m saying, relative towards other hunts and that’s what makes the difference. And I learned way back when – I never will forget in this industry and I saw an ad not too long ago like in the last couple of weeks somebody advertising for discriminating hunters, grey poupon hunters. Man, duck hunters want to go and kill ducks and have a good time. And it took meeting the right Texan one time, the man had a little – he had some deep pockets generational type stuff and I was flying into 5 star this and that and he said, whoa! He reeled me in like a cowboy on a horse, Whoa boy, whoa! He said you got me hung on the wrong pig. He said there ain’t a lodge in that country that rivals my guest house, he said, but if you come to my duck camp and it’s a good duck camp, I got a 10 by 70 mobile home if you want a place to sit and eat your rib eye steak, you got to pull a lab off that couch. He said, son, I want to go on a real duck – I’m a real duck hunter, I want to go on a real duck hunting. Man, that’s like a bolt of lightning hit me, I said that’s it, I’m a real duck hunter. I don’t care nothing about edible art desserts, that ain’t me, 5 stars wines, that ain’t me. I can go to any liquor store and buy wine. I just want to go into good duck hunt with good duck hunters. Can you believe in 2 years we’ll be literally 20 years old, this business and never dreamed it would open up like it did.

Zack Kile: And I bet you relying on word of mouth, return customers now more than anything I would imagine.

Ramsey Russell: Absolutely. We have an incredible amount of returning customers and anybody in the outfitting business that does not have, you’re just doing it wrong. We were talking when I come in here, used to work at a hardware store, I’ve been going to forever. And you go to home depot, good luck finding help and if I need one screw, I got about 20 of them, if I find them. Instead of a hardware store you were going to, you walk in with one boat, one screw, one something 5 people wait one you. One person takes where you are, you’re a person. It’s a service. And it’s a people business because my business, you all’s coffee business, that hardware business, we’re all doing the same thing, we’re in the people business. It’s all about relationships. We do have a lot of customers but we do have – you know, look, I treat all my customers the same. I’ve got customers that can afford 30 or 40 days a year out in the field around the world. And I’ve got guys that have saved their money and worked hard to go on that once in a lifetime trip. But you know what the distinction I’ve learned between the two is Donald Trump vs Ramsey Russell, time is the limiting factor for both people. And if you saved your money hard like I did to go on that bad Canada hunt way back when you’ve lost time and money. And that’s really where we come in. And we don’t just sell hunts, we just don’t. Like some of these outfitters we work with around the world we’ve been with for 12 or 13 years. When you get married, what do you know about this woman? 12, 13 years into it, you’ve got a life partner. Now you go buy lab pup, you send it to a trainer. What do you really know about that dog? Buddy, you can talk, you got the proof after 7 or 8 years of that dog fetching same with a gun. You’ve been shooting the same gun 15 years because you believe in it. You see what I’m saying is, time builds these things. And we really evolved relationships with a lot of our outfitters now they do what they do and we do what we do. It’s just like, we market and we take care of the clients, all the paperwork, all the permits, all this, all that and explain it to them and then they show up and the guide brings it, he does what he does.

“See I love that, some people might look at get ducks and say well this is a premium product for guys that have more money than myself. But how many years do you have to waste on guides that you’re not sure about? And how much money do you have to throw down the drain testing these guys out or word of mouth where you could go to Ramsey Russell and buy a hunt that has proven.”

Zack Kile: See I love that, some people might look at get ducks and say well this is a premium product for guys that have more money than myself. But how many years do you have to waste on guides that you’re not sure about? And how much money do you have to throw down the drain testing these guys out or word of mouth where you could go to Ramsey Russell and buy a hunt that has proven. You already know the people there are going to be excellent. Of course there’s going to be variables as far as ducks. Ducks are going to be ducks –

Ramsey Russell: Especially in the U.S and North America, yeah.

Jonathan Wilson: Yeah. So, is it better overseas? Is it more -?

Ramsey Russell: You know what you really see even as close as Mexico certainly down in Argentina, Mongolia, Azerbaijan a lot of these other places really and truly the difference is hunting pressure. You know that place Rio Salado I want my ashes scattered. And I don’t mean to disenfranchise other 3 partners down in Argentina because they’ve all got very good hunts but it’s like you go into a boot store, I got steel toe boots, I got full quill Ostrich I got whatever because not one size fits all. So, I’ve got something for everybody. But this place is for me, it’s unabated, it’s wild, it’s remote, it’s 130 square miles, it’s me in a blind by myself. And it’s not even like going to a place, it’s like going to a point on the 1850s timeline, it’s that kind of place. And it’s not for everybody because you can’t hardly get there from here. Some people that want a closer, more convenient trip and that’s fine, we got other hunts for that. So, we’ve got a little something with everybody, but 130sq miles of the most beautiful, pristine natural marsh that I’ve seen on God’s earth so far. And every week there’s 10 people, 15 people hunting it. And to get to the north end of it, it’s a 3 hour drive, we don’t go there and to get to the northeast side of it, there ain’t no roads. So, you’ve got whatever. You got 500 square miles of just refuge. And it’s incredible. There’s no way to run down the river channel, the river channel about as wide as your room is. I’d call it a ditch around here but it’s a river. They got a motorized boat, but once you step out, you’re on foot or like in a p-row. And most of the places we hunt there is no motor, if it’s motorized, it’s either motorized with a bird boy or motorized with a horse pulling it, they don’t scare ducks. You know what I’m saying? It’s just an adventure.

Zack Kile: Yeah, it really is. So, I’ve heard you on the podcast before on trade shows, me and Jonathan, we built this company. We were essentially out of the house and then when we got in front of customers and we went to a trade show, it opened up for us. It really changed for us. And I know you started – I believe you started at trade shows. Did you not or did you work a lot of trade shows?

“It’s like I told you all earlier we’re drinking that cup of coffee and I started getting this buzz, but we’re all focused, we’ve got to make a living, we’ve got to pay bills, we’ve got to take care of our kids and our families, but we’ve got to make a life. And so get ducks for us is a life.”

Ramsey Russell: No, we really were a long ways into it before we went to the big shows. We started very humbly with a small web page, back in the day they were chat rooms, that’s where I knew Rocky, that’s where I knew a lot of guys like, that’s where I know practically everybody imported my life, my lawyer, my doctors, my insurance guy Duck South, they all come off that chat room and they were real, it’s like a modern day coffee shop. Real friendship were formed. And I’d say my best 20 or 30 friends from around here are off that website now. You know, back in those days when you’re proud around the chat room, you just had a signature, you have to link something like that. But if you went and googled words Argentina duck hunting, we were nowhere to be found, which you get with a free web page. And really back in the 2008-2009 when the whole big mortgage thing imploded the economy collapsed my phone started blowing up. I had 10 or 15 people on my phone under ad guy, they were calling me to buy ads I’m like, I don’t know and we don’t want to buy an ad $1,500 ad I don’t want to buy no ads. But I started me thinking how are they finding me? Why are they finding, why are they calling me because I’m nobody. And you know with the economy like it was a lot of the people that traveled regularly were not – they were upside down on their mortgage and they lost, they look poor on paper, whatever. And so the people in my business weren’t selling hunts so they weren’t advertising. So the people that sell advertising were, hey, we need some new meat and I thought about that, I said, it’s time to step up and we did, we found a brick and mortar business and we went in and explained our situation, which is very different than a normal hunting website. A very normal pick a place duck hunt. He’s got 5 or 10 pages. Well, we need that for multiple outputs and other things and other things. Long story short all these years later 13, 14 years later we’ve got 2200 google index pages. Google is pointing 23,000 plus duck hunting related search phrases that our web page. We rank on the 1^st page of google for over 3000, we rank in the first place for over 300. That’s crazy, isn’t it? That’s what happens when you get a guy like me, that’s kind of ODD and drinks a lot of coffee had not doing work on the web page. But then once that kicked up, once we got to that level one, I quit my federal government job, just like you all did, went all in. And we went to this little local show over here in Jackson. And I met a man who became a very good influence in my life and a very good friend about the 3^rd time he come by the booth, he says you need to go to Dallas Safari club. I go, what the heck is that? He goes, you need to go, well I couldn’t get in. Boy, good luck getting in that show today and I called a favor. And somebody had canceled for the year, so I got in their booth but once you’re in, you’re in. This will be our 12^th or 13^th year and it’s just like for 4 days, my first time at Dallas Safari Club, my eyes this big, I forgot all about everything. I mean it’s like holy cow, the energy and now we’re in SCI in Dallas Safari club and a bunch of smaller shows. And I think what really got me going to SCI and what I really appreciate most about conventions is, I know a lot of these young guys listening, I know my kids that age got their nose on the phone, I get it, I’m in social media because that’s how we connect with folks today. But you know what, there are still people that want to look a man in the eye and shake a hand and read body language and that is where – Man, Safari Club International and Dallas Safari Club, they’re both during duck season, it’s kind of hard for somebody to start off as a duck hunter that want to go there during what could be the best part of our season down here in the Deep South. But man after about the 15^th or 16^th or 17^th call one year, well will I see you at SCI I started saying yes sir, as soon as I can get in there and it transformed our business. And duck hunting is a very niche and small, as big as it seems relative to deer hunting, relative to big game, it’s still a very small fish in the pond, but you know what, it’s okay to be in a small pond if you’re a big fish. And so we have created a tremendous amount of brand in roads. It’s just been an incredible life. It’s like I told you all earlier we’re drinking that cup of coffee and I started getting this buzz, but we’re all focused, we’ve got to make a living, we’ve got to pay bills, we’ve got to take care of our kids and our families, but we’ve got to make a life. And so get ducks for us is a life. It’s still just a huge adventure for myself. It’s like, right, by the time I think I’ve seen and done it all. I never will forget the first time, I took my son, he was – I don’t know, 15, my oldest son was 15 at the time it’s been a while, we go to Argentina and took both of my sons and it froze. And that morning for the 1^st time ever in Argentina, there’s ice on the water and we shot 5 ducks and we go back to lodge and I’m like, man, I’ve never seen it before and Diego’s like, just wait till this afternoon and he said, oh man, just be out here in an hour and we’ll go back and we’ll shoot, just wait. And my youngest son Duncan went with Mr. Ian and out shot him. Me and Forrest went to another pond and we were just beating on 65 ducks a man day big old limit and then all of a sudden I never forget a flock of speckled tail come through and we didn’t cut a feather, it was dark and he goes, can you all see it? I can’t see nothing. And there were a million candle power and I’m thinking its legal. Man, right by the time you think you’ve seen and done it all, somebody breaks out of spotlight, you’ll see what a yellow billed pintail does when a million candle power hits and you sit there and flap like them off and then you’re laughing so hard, you miss it.

Zack Kile: That’s hilarious. That is so cool.

Jonathan Wilson: I love it.

Zack Kile: Man, I do too. That’s just nothing like it. Man, the characters that you know, I listened to your podcast, I’m a big fan of your podcast. Mr. Ian, you had him on the podcast, there’s something about accents and voices that – I hate my voice listening to it. I don’t have – I’m not that storyteller, but you find and you were one of the best storytellers, Mr. Ian, he’s the fellow from Go Devil.

Ramsey Russell: Oh yeah, Warren Choco.

“My goodness, there’s something I said, this on our last podcast, storytelling is a – I don’t know if it’s learned or if it’s an old school art really. And man, if you want to hear good stories, your podcast has some of the best and man, what is it about that?”

Zack Kile: My goodness, there’s something I said, this on our last podcast, storytelling is a – I don’t know if it’s learned or if it’s an old school art really. And man, if you want to hear good stories, your podcast has some of the best and man, what is it about that? Just sitting on the front porch, I’m sure you listen to your grandpa tell stories. Did it just come naturally? What is that?

Ramsey Russell: I don’t know, I read a lot growing up, it’s just my generation and I like to read. And I always had my nose in a book, not that I didn’t do outside stuff too, but I like to read books. But my grandfather – I remember maybe on Friday nights he’d watched the John Wayne show or something like that, me sitting in his lap, when I was a child. And I know if my grandmother wanted to, he and her would sit on 1 weekend night and we spend the night and they’d watch Lawrence Welk but other than that, we sat around the dinner table about this size right here and he told stories. And do you know how since we started recording stories and podcast, do you know how – if I just had one wish I’d go back and I turn on the record. I remember some of it, but I don’t remember all of it and I’d love to hear him and my grandmother on the other side, I’d love to hear those stories again. And I don’t know, it just a lot is getting lost in the information age. Since the dawn of time, humanity has been telling stories on the side of cave walls or hand me down stories, like a lot of the old testament was told passed on from generations just as word of mouth before it was printed and it seems like it’s crazy as it sounds, I don’t have time to read books, like I used to, now if I go get on a 16 hour flight, I got time but we don’t have time, we don’t make time. And I just feel like a lot of stories are getting lost.

Jonathan Wilson: It seems like asking somebody to come on the podcast is an inconvenience but you willingly jumped on it and we appreciate that. But do you feel like the advent of podcasts, it may help preserve that?

Ramsey Russell: Yeah, I do. Because I think it’s a generational thing with each subsequent generation. Your kids are not going to read as much as you did. You probably don’t read as much as your granddad did. But what we can do is we can passively listen and hear these stories while we’re driving, while we’re roasting coffee while we’re doing something. So yeah, I think it will.

Jonathan Wilson: I asked a kid the other day, a little friend of mine, a little buddy and he said, he liked listening to podcast. I mean he’s 10, 11 years old. And I said, well, what is it that you like about podcasts? And he said the stories, that’s all he said, the stories. And I said, well that’s what we hope ours is going to be about the stories. And there’s other podcasts out there like yours that tells some awesome stories and that’s what we’re all about. I mean, the first few episodes we’re just us talking, stories from growing up and that’s we’re all about a good story.

Ramsey Russell: Nobody listens to just one podcast. You know, most people listen to a bunch of them. I dialed into a bunch of them, I listen to you all’s. So, I just tell anybody jump in, on the one hand, maybe it is competitive don’t evenhanded it’s not, that’s what cares. And the big thing about us, yes, we do have some sponsors, but the big thing about us is, I’m getducks.com and this podcast is an extension of that. And you all are a coffee shop and your podcast is an extension of that and that in and of itself keeps it true enough and authentic enough. You follow what I’m saying? And it lets the listener kind of connect and know who you are beyond the coffee bag and that’s important.

Jonathan Wilson: That’s our goal. We’re not just sitting over here cranking out coffee, we’re living the life too. Behind the brand.

Zack Kile: So, we’re relatively new to duck hunting, we started two years ago.

Ramsey Russell: How old are you all?

Zack Kile: I’m 31.

Jonathan Wilson: I’m 37.

Zack Kile: And so we had no friends growing up that duck hunted, my folks they deer hunted, they didn’t do the duck hunting thing. And so it was something that came along a lot later in life and that’s why Rocky Leflore listening to those podcasts kind of helped us to get into it. But one thing I noticed turkey hunting, they have books, books are big in turkey hunting, the history. What is that for duck hunting? Is there a history of my books that are –

Ramsey Russell: There are some good books Nash Buckingham comes to mind, my buddy Jim Cruz just wrote an Amid the Cypress. Some of his stories. He’s been hunting the same cypress break up in the North Delta and other places of course worldwide. But he’s been hunting the same, those same brakes for 40 or 50 years and I would challenge maybe turkey hunting. But I don’t think that any other species of hunting has the rich cultural history that duck hunting does. Look at the old antique duck calls, the antique clothes. I was telling somebody from Mossy Oak about a garment I’ve had since whenever the early 80s like man, you could sell that thing for a fortune right now I’m like, no, I’ve been wearing it forever, I’m not selling nothing. But of course I can’t fit into it no more, my grandkids will one day. But still I’m just saying that the call, the decoys, the clothing, the shotguns, the print, the pictures, the heritage. I mean there’s this rich tradition which we try to really – I know there are duck hunting podcast out there to talk about how to or – man great, listen to them, if that’s you but for me, I firmly in my heart of hearts believed that the future of hunting and especially the future of duck hunting lies in its past. And by that, I mean my grandfather was a very practical person. Duck hunting for him was not a religion, it was just something he did with his friends to socialize the gear he bought, he bought and expected it to last forever. His memories, his photographs, I still got a duck call, a fox duck call and a Earl Dennison called from back in the 40s and 50s that were his, he bought that only two duck calls he had, hit bottom and lasted forever. You know what I’m saying? But what I remember is it just seems back in those days that that generation of hunter had a respect for themselves, had respect for other hunters and had respect for the resource. You got to understand Donald Trump comes out saying, let’s make America great again, well think about the generation that made it great to start with. And that’s those guys that, that the world’s greatest generation to me that went out and subdued Hitler and defeated Japan and came back home and created this burgeoning middle class and they were also the generation that created Ducks Unlimited because there was a drought going on. And I really think there’s a lot to that, it’s very easy with all the product and we’ve elevated every aspect of duck hunting to art form the gear, the clothing, the long johns, the waiters, the shelves, the camo, the ammo I mean everything, everything is state of the art and we American hunters, we’re mad at those ducks. My granddad might have hunted 12 times a season back in the day in his backyard until later, did he go to Cairo for 3 days to shoot Canada geese, man duck hunters today, it ain’t nothing. Let’s go to Kansas, let’s go to Washington, let’s go to Canada, let’s go to Mexico, let’s go. I hunt a bunch of days, but I’m not unique. There’s a lot of guys that are hunting way more than 60 days or crowding 60 days by the time they’ve been around creating this experience but I think that in there to sell and market a lot of this product. Sometimes the message of respect and what that duck should mean when you hold it and that’s a business. I think it gets lost in the noise sometimes. I think there’s just a little bit of false narrative out there. If you’re new to duck hunting and you think that those great big old cord wood piles that we all want to hunt, I want to hunt them. If you think that’s the everyday occurrence, you’re going to be sadly disappointed because it ain’t. It’s just not, those are the really good days. And I interviewed my uncle not too long ago, 75 years old and he hadn’t duck hunted for a long time, he’s a deer hunter now. And I asked him and he couldn’t remember how many ducks they killed, how many limits and all he talked about falling in the ice, the dogs and he can still remember 50 or 60 years later a particular duck that my grandfather missed. You know what I’m saying? It’s so much more than just the piles. And we’re right in the middle of kind of running a interviewing some folks out west, it’s kind of a drought series, we’ve talked to Ducks Unlimited, we’ve talked with delta waterfowl. I’ve got a very big meeting tomorrow about the Klamath water wars. We’ve talked to somebody up in northern California, we’ve talked to a couple of biologists over in Utah, it’s an epic drought. It’s like 173 year drought and what is that emplaces, what is that going to do to duck productivity? We uncounted ducks, the government has been able to count ducks for 2 years, what are they going to find? And so to me, especially if this drought persists, if this drought goes into another year or 2, you’re going to start looking at 30 days and 3 ducks here in the Deep South. Where are these guys that have drank the Kool-Aid and believe I’ve got to have a cord wood pile of 100 dead geese and where are they going to be if they can’t legally do that? You know what I’ve evolved and I get out of duck hunting is beyond that. If I look back the last duck season, I don’t remember a single bird, I don’t remember a single strap, I don’t remember that. What I remember the north has changed. We got quite, I thought something that I was appalled like clear the headlights. I remember the people, I remember the conversations, I remember drinking hot coffee and I remember all the little nuances and then that’s what duck hunting is to me, duck hunting is very subjective. And I’ll say something about you all being older people in your 30s starting to duck hunt, it’s a foregone conclusion that our kids that the kids of hunters are going to be introduced to hunting, we need more hunters. I know your public land hunters don’t like to hear it but truth matter is we need more hunters. And really and truly if you get your little 8 year old boy, 10 year old boy hooked on hunting, great. But the fact of the matter is it’s going to be 2 decades before he has the income to generate meaningful political relevance, spend money, buy that equipment generate those tax dollars, that’s what I’m saying. And that’s downing, we need guys like yourself, getting into duck hunting.

Zack Kile: Well, that’s something that we did going in and we’ve talked about this kind of like what you just said, we set our expectations really low. A lot of people say there’s a massive learning curve to duck hunting and no doubt there is. I mean, when I first got into duck hunting, I thought all the duck did was quack, I had no clue that was 2 years ago, I had no clue. But we set our expectations really low. And I mean, what we do, a lot of guys wouldn’t get too excited about but man, we’re just enjoying doing it. We’ll go to a slew and shoot some wood ducks and my dog grabbed them that I trained myself and that’s what it’s all about to us. And I think there is a generation coming up that enjoys the history. We might not have grown up doing it. My grandpa didn’t tell me duck hunting stories, he didn’t have any, but it’s something that we’re interested in learning more about and that’s why we enjoy podcasts telling stories like this.

Ramsey Russell: But that’s okay, you’ve got your own stories and they’re important too. Like, first thing I told you when I walked in, I want to get you on the podcast, I like what you’re doing, you know what I’m saying? And that’s just what duck hunting is to me. And one of the cool things I’ve learned if I hadn’t learned but one thing in the past 20 years with get ducks dealing with thousands of people, duck hunting is very subjective. 4 guys go to any given lodge and if we send out a post hunt survey to all of our clients, it’s a long questionnaire, it takes a few minutes to fill out, but it kind of keeps my fingers on the pulse and it just amazes me sometimes a team of 4 that have been best friends forever, they go to one particular lodge for a week and it’s like, when you read their post hunt surveys, it’s like they went on 4 different places because it’s so subjective and that’s okay. That’s great.

Zack Kile: Absolutely. So, where did you get – you’re in central Mississippi now, but is that where you grew up? Because this is not the duck hunting capital of the world here in central Mississippi.

Ramsey Russell: No, I was born and raised in Greenville, Mississippi. We moved down to Byram down in South Hinds County back in the late 70s, that’s where I went to high school moved to Mississippi state, lived in Grenada and then when I transferred agencies and went to a different job for a period of time before I started get ducks, lived here in Brandon, we’ve lived in Brandon for 20 years. So, we’re all neighbors now and I realized, you all were moving to Pearl, I said they’re just right down the road, in fact, I get my tires changed a couple of doors down the Firestone.

Zack Kile: Better believe it. And that’s definitely something that when I found out you were in Brandon and you being the duck hunter that you are, I’m like, well there’s not a lot around here, you got to drive a little ways to get in the ducks real good and that’s something that we found. So, you talked about your dog earlier, is dog’s been in the picture for you because like I said, that’s what got me into duck hunting.

Ramsey Russell: Oh yeah, I mean, absolutely. My grandfather, I had one lab, it’s a long story and my uncle tells and he got it from my mother’s godfather and it was just one of them 90lb kill every other dog he sees and as I heard the story, my grandfather never told me this, but as I heard the story, they were somewhere and they got out Kennel let his dog loose and by the time they got their guns loaded, everything else that dog kills 5 man’s chickens or something and he reached out and that’s about 40-50 yards, he shot in the butt with birdshot and my granddad just had to come apart and he said well you have that dog then Mr. Russell and he went home with it. And my uncle described countless the neighbor’s dog got killed, just the big air dales and stuff this dog was fierce baddest dog on neighborhood. And there’s one story about him in the canoe hunting somewhere up in the delta and the dog flipped the canoe over, he lost a model 12 shotgun. And during World War II, the then owner of Greenville Lumber Company and he were friends and it was so interesting because times were different because he was friends with these men his entire life. Like my uncle would tell a story about going deer hunting as a 13 year old kid and barring doctor hands, deer rifle, break-break all those many years later in the 80s 30, 40 years later, Dr. Ham was one that was in my granddad’s bedroom, checked his heart with a stethoscope and took it off and looked at my uncle said he’s passed. A little friendship for forever. But anyway this guy had written him a letter, he was in Germany and Netherlands and he had written a letter and somewhere I’ve seen this letter, I think I’ve got it in a pile of papers and it said something to fact, I found the most perfect breed, it was English springer spaniel. So growing up, that’s what we hunted over were English springers spaniel. And in fact I’ve got my 3^rd lab or 4^th lab now char but before then, when I was you all’s age, I raised full springer’s. Their skin gets wet, they’re smaller dogs, but God, they got such an amazing heart and enthusiasm, I just love them. Excellent pheasant dog, dove dogs, things of that nature, but they are important. I can remember I had this black lab named Delta, I just remember we’re out there teal hunting and she jumped up on the 4 wheeler and I just realized she’s getting old and I said something to my wife said man, Delta is getting old, she just really kind of losing her pep this year and my wife’s like she’s only 9 years old. I know it seems like she’s acting like she’s 12 or 13. And when I go to a hotel with this dog, she knew it was cool, she’d find her a chair or a couch or bed and jump up, she fights you for covers at night, but at home and camp she didn’t have to get on furniture. And one day I walked in to my camp and she was right in the middle of the bed, she was deaf, she was deaf as this table right here. And I walked in and I patted her hard to get onto an old dog like that and she wagged her tail and got down and got into bed. And we went out there to feed her that evening and her urine was off color like and I noticed for a couple of days she wasn’t beating me to the kennel to eat. Usually when you break that dog food out, she’s sitting there waiting on you by the time you walk out there to feed her. And I noticed that night she wasn’t eating at all. So I took her to the vet, well she must have a little infection or something like that and doctor called me up and said, hey Mr. Russell we need to operate and we put this dog on a lot of steroids and her white blood cell counts real high and that’s never good, we just need to crack it open and take a look. I said, yeah, well call me, when you get done, let me know what you find here, no I need your permission to put the dog down. I said, well I guess I’ll come back and get it for a couple of nights. He goes, I understand, but your dog hadn’t eaten in 2 or 3 days, something’s going on and I’m going to tell you all man, I mean, when that vet called me back about 2 hours later and they said, they put my dog down, I locked myself in the camp for 3 days and I texted, my wife I said, I was distraught. And that was the longest most – that was 2 weeks before the Arkansas duck season open. And I was in the camp at the time, they had dog, everybody had a good dog and that was great but it wasn’t my dog, I’ll never forget it. And I got this little char dog now who I love and I just had old coop chicken dog who was from up around Lewisville is where she came from and they were both great dogs and it just adds so much that little yellow chicken dog, really good retriever. She could route a duck out of anything, but she wouldn’t take pressure, so you couldn’t teach that dog to handle it. You need to be able to pressure a dog to get them to that point and she wouldn’t take it and neither would her sister from a repeat breeding that Forrest owns and her daughter is dumb as a brick end up but a great pet. And they just don’t take pressure. But that dog had hunted all 4 flyways and countless states picked up more birds even than Delta did, she was a great dog. And now I got this little char dog and she’s a pistol, she’s 3 years old, last season alone she picked up 30 waterfowl species and all 4 flyways and just an absolute and she was green as a gourd in teal season. But every hunt, you see her, just take one more step of being a great dog. And it brings so much to it.

Zack Kile: I see that you hear that dogs get hunt savvy like that and they might not be good at the games, but I see yours is racking up the ribbons this summer.

Ramsey Russell: They are. I’m not driven by ribbons or rewards, but I do like to train that dog and get them to that point and I’m usually traveling so much and even if I weren’t traveling, I raise a dog, I teach at the basic sit, heel, fetch blah-blah. But when it comes to force fetch on, I give to somebody that knows what they’re talking about and they do a great job. And to me it’s a benchmark and knowing what this dog is capable of. So, now if there’s a teal drifting off in the tide 150 yards out there, I know this dog will handle. But besides that, training all dogs aren’t equal. Your kids are different people, different interests, different aptitudes. And the number one thing you got to have, I’ve seen with a – no matter what you expect of that dog, if a dog is not eat up want to turn inside to get that duck, it’s the wrong dog. And raising kids and we’ve gotten rid of – I was telling my trainer the other day, we got into conversation, I’ve gotten rid of a bunch of dogs. I buy puppies, but they ain’t keepers until and you’ve got to be willing to say this dog doesn’t want to fetch, this dog make somebody a really good pet. But it’s not going to be a duck dog. And you’ve got to be willing to do that and we have. My son’s first dog worthless. I’ve never seen a 6 month old lab that wouldn’t even come to you when called. And we spent a lot of time on that dog and we got rid of him, now you’ve got a great dog, you’ve got to be willing to get rid of a dog. And then you’ve got to just accept like my chicken dog, you got to just accept her temperament what she’s capable of and build a relationship that old dog Delta after she was deaf, she was master titled in 16 months. She was just that progeny that dog won’t last 2 years of life she was deaf and all that whistling all that handling all that stuff was just out the window. Why are you going to knick or correct dog? They can’t hear you. So, I can remember climbing out of the pit or stepping outside the trees, sitting there on my hands in my pocket, she’d take a line and boom you send her and off she’d go and you’re thinking she’s 30 yards off and what she would do is she’d hunt, she’d make the mark and she’d hunt. But then she turned around and look at you, now you handle her and then she’d go hunt. But on the flip side of that is countless worth of the times when I could blow a whistle, I knew where that duck was down about that willow tree and I’d blow and blow and whistling maybe knickers, no because she knew because she had to know she was on the job, she knew that duck swam over here. Oh man, I love figuring it out with dogs, they had so much to it.

Zack Kile: It’s such a blast. My first duck hunt, my dog was with me. I mean, I trained him beforehand and so that’s an exciting thing. Do you get to take them overseas at all?

Ramsey Russell: And she’s also a – due to my medical history and stuff, char is – and so was Cooper, they were a service animal and they are very docile. I mean look man, so many people have abused bringing dogs on planes, you ought to see the stewardess when you get on over there with the dog they’re like, oh my God, we got to deal with this. And I have seen little old ladies in high heels, get drug down the aisle by big old rambunctious dogs, just like you see them walking around the neighborhood, the dogs walking them instead of the other way around. But char and coop both man, I get on a plane and countless of the times, you know when I sit down the flight they just crawled up onto my leg, lay down. Countless of the times the guy next to me when the flights over and they pop your head up and he go, oh you got a dog? I actually took my char dog to Netherland for a month and a half one time and Cooper, I should have said, but char if everything goes right, she’ll go to Argentina with me next year. She’s been to Mexico, she’s been to Canada next year we’re going to Argentina.

Zack Kile: Man, that’s neat. Nothing like bringing your dog. We’re about 50 minutes in. I do have a final question, this is a little selfish here. But me and Jonathan are putting in for teal this year for the draws and on the WMA’s, what do we need to be ready for? I never hunted teal in our lives other than we did kill a few last year during the regular duck season in the delta. But what do we need to be ready for early season teal?

Ramsey Russell: Ready to walk because some of the better WMA’s you got to walk a little bit, that’s fine. It’s warm. Don’t be scared of snakes, they will be out, bring bug dope because there will be bugs. But the great thing about blue wing teal hunting, I would tell you bring whatever decoys you got. I do hunt over big spreads of teal decoys, birds of a feather flock together. I do like the dark brown teal decoys not the big colorful but it doesn’t matter. And bring a teal call sounds like Popeye and bring a mojo. Mojo dove at least, bring the mojo. And bring some polls because sometimes you’re in rain cover and you need to get it up above that cover and be patient and don’t be late because especially in Mississippi you all may only hunt – say shooting time – what I’m just making this up 06:30 hunt maybe over at 07:05.

Zack Kile: It’s quick.

Ramsey Russell: It can be. And old Terry Denmon and he ain’t wrong, he only says when those barn swallows come out and starts eating the hunts over. A lot of truth to that, but I can remember one time had an outdoor writer Brian Broome over at camp with us and we were hunting and it’s been just a terrible – I mean, bird just kind of passed through Mississippi and we didn’t kill much to speak up but he wanted to come over and do a story and we were sitting there at 8 o’clock me, Jim Crews and Brian Broome. Brian was just writing and we were hunting at 08:00 we hadn’t fired a shot and it’s just warm and sultry and not a breath of wind and I felt just the slightest little breeze on my left cheek and I can see a little coffee weed leaflets starting to blow and that was that front they talked about. 10 mile an hour, little breeze coming out of the north and I said, I think we ought to stick it out 30 minutes and in 25 minutes we had 2 limits of blue wing teal, they just like that bam bam they passed through. So it was worth sticking it out for.

Zack Kile: Worth sticking it out. So just putting in the time learning those things, obviously we wouldn’t see that and think that, but just staying would have resulted in that as well for us.

Ramsey Russell: But to me Zach, the greatest thing about blue wing teal hunting for young people or young hunters trying to figure this out, it’s the perfect time. It’s not technical. You don’t need calls, put the decoys out where they can see them, put that mojo so they’ll see them. And you don’t even have to be perfectly hide, just back off into the shadows real good and be still and be patient and don’t miss. And if you fall in or whatever you’re doing, it’s just perfect time of year to figure it out.

Zack Kile: I’m fired up for it already.

Jonathan Wilson: Tyler’s going to like that.

Zack Kile: Yeah, he is. Man, I can’t wait. Well man, we really appreciate you coming by. We have to have you on again, so please stop by. I know you’re a busy man, but we’ll definitely have to have you back in here before duck season, but certainly soon.

Ramsey Russell: I’d like to invite everybody listening to come and see us at Duck Season Somewhere podcast and Jonathan and Zack are going to be on there just as soon as I come back to record and I guarantee you all have got – and I’m going to give you all a shout out and I’m serious. I love to see young people get out of the rat race and chase the American dream and you all are. And you’ve got a good product that a cup of coffee was very good, thank you all. And I’m proud to see my neighbors, a couple of Mississippi boys chasing the American dream and I know you all are doing good because I see you everywhere and I want to hear your story.

Zack Kile: Yes sir.

Jonathan Wilson: We appreciate that. It means a lot coming from you and I appreciate you stopping by and anything you want to –

Zack Kile: Where can everybody find you on Instagram, Facebook, your website, what is all that?

Ramsey Russell: Instagram at @RamseyRussell.Getducks go to getducks.com and start pushing buttons. I mean, its 2200 google index pages. Spend some time if you’d like YouTube getducks, Facebook getduck but Instagram is where we spend the most time and the podcast, Duck Season Somewhere.

Jonathan Wilson: Duck season somewhere. Well, we appreciate you stopping by and hopefully we’ll catch up with you again.

Ramsey Russell: Thank you, Jonathan. Thank you all both. I’ve enjoyed it.

Zack Kile: Thank you so much man.

Jonathan Wilson: Well, this has been The Backwoods Grind podcast and we hope you’ve enjoyed the show today. And if you’d like to purchase a bag of coffee from us, it’s backwoodsgrind.com and you can look us up on Instagram @backwoodsgrindcoffee. Search for us on Facebook and any other social media platform backwoods grind coffee company and you’ll probably find us. Shoot us a message we’d love to hear from you, chat with you about what you got going on and we look forward to talking to you in the next one see you.

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